Is It Selfish to Desire to Be Filled With God?

The topics of self-renunciation, preparing one's soul for divine communion, and discerning God's will versus self-will are discussed in this month’s chat discussion. The conversation delves into the seemingly paradoxical nature of desiring to be filled with God, questioning whether this aspiration is self-centered or a true act of love and sacrifice. 

Members, including a Visitation Sister, share personal experiences and theological insights, referencing saints and religious practices to illustrate how self-renunciation and abandoning self-will are integral to deepening one's relationship with God.

And check out the Living Jesus Chat Room of the Visitation Sisters. Each Sunday we read a passage of St. Francis de Sales and then gather great insights and sharing.

Is the Desire to Be Filled with God Selfish?

Question: Is it born out of a self-interested desire to be totally empty and filled with God? Is it, in fact, a selfish/self-centered pursuit?

Visitation Sister: This question fits in with a retreat: What does it mean to prepare our souls for something? How can we do this?

Sherry: I would be interested – what can this “something” be? I prepared my soul for my consecration last year. We prepare our souls for Easter and Christmas, I guess. Preparing our soul is maybe taking every distraction away intentionally. Why is no-one saying something? Help me out, ladies!

Rose: First immerse oneself in the presence of God. Maybe then we can begin to empty ourselves from the cares of this world.

Visitation Sister: When I was preparing for vows, I prepared with the Song of Songs and other Scripture passages.

Sherry: Oh... That is so, so wonderful, Sr. Susan. Song of Songs…So beautiful. I love what you wrote, Rose.

Denise: Preparing our souls…for self-renunciation?

Sherry: That fits with the letter, Denise.

Visitation Sister: St Jane did so.

Sherry: What do you mean by that, Sister?

Visitation Sister: When St Francis was leading her to depend only on God in the 1616 retreat she had.

Denise: What the newsletter speaks of, a letter to St Jane from St Francis.

Visitation Sister: Yes.

Do You Fail to Notice What is Your Own Will?

Question: What is self-renunciation?

Sherry: Does that go hand in hand with abandonment to God’s will?

Visitation Sister: I think it does actually.

Denise: It is dying, I think, the process of dying to ourselves.

Rose: I think we come to a point in our lives when we fully embrace everything that happened in the past, is happening in the present and will happen in the future as God’s Will. That everything is exactly how God wants it to be.

Visitation Sister: We renounce our self-will to follow God’s will.

Sherry: To erase the desire of comfort in us.

Denise: Many times in the past I followed my will!

Sherry: Oh, Denise... I was and am in some ways still so attached to my own will – that I do not even notice that this is my own will.

Denise: Yes, and I said in the past ha. It is a struggle. Well expressed, Sherry. I do not even notice that this is my own will.

Visitation Sister: Unless we have been fully immersed in union with God, I think this is always a struggle or a possibility.

Sherry: I agree. Oh, holy unity. It must feel so wonderful to be free from ourselves – from our wounded selves.

Denise: Oh yes….

Visitation Sister: The freedom of eternal life, with God.

Rose: So true.

Tear Me Away From Myself

Question: What would it be like to make it a habit to say the prayer that St. Francis suggests, “tear me away from myself. O self, I put you away forever….”

Sherry: I think it needs a good foundation of genuine love of and for God – so it truly is lived out of “love for obedience” and not “fear of disobedience.”

Rose: Our love of self can be our biggest enemy at times.

Sherry: Disordered love for sure, Rose.

Rose: We yearn to be just like Him and not ourselves anymore.

Visitation Sister: It depends on one’s personality in some respects, If we pray that prayer and then have guilt when we do not follow through would not be so good. But not everybody would respond like that to a slip up.

Denise: These letters, I believe, St. Francis knew St. Jane well, and could direct her.

Rose: Sadly, some forget how powerful God’s grace is.

Sherry: AMEN, Rose. I had to remind my daughter today that the Eucharist is the medicine for sinners not the reward for saints.

Praying on the Spot

Question: Why are spontaneous prayers just as important as our timely, disciplined prayers?

Denise: They may be a prompting of the Holy Spirit.

Sherry: For me spontaneous prayers are more “normal” than scheduled prayers. I am working on that though.

Rose: They truly come from the heart.

Sherry: And yes to Denise and Rose. I totally agree with both of you.

Rose: I sometimes tend to shift to my native tongue during spontaneous prayers.

Sherry: Rose. Native tongue? Which one?

Rose: Oh, Sherry, I was born and raised in the Philippines. I am Filipino.

Sherry: How lovely. Here are four seminarians from the Philippines. I find it interesting that I switch to my mother language more in the Divine office prayers. But my spontaneous prayers are in English usually.

Rose: What is your mother language Sherry may I ask?

Sherry: Rose, I am from Austria and my mother language is German.

Denise: Sr Susan, how would you answer this?

Visitation Sister: I agree, but sometimes the prayers written in the past were so beautiful and full of depth that they also help the soul grow.

Denise: Thank you. Perhaps those prayers in the Divine Office. Or a neighbor gifted me with a small traditional missal from the 1940’s and its beautiful prayers.

Sherry: WOW, Denise. What an amazing gift.

Anna: Sister Susan, which prayer book are you referring to?

Visitation Sister: The Visitation Manual.

Rose: Is the Visitation Manual given to those in formation, Sister?

Visitation Sister: Yes, in our Monastery it was.

Sherry: By the way, Anna, check that link out. This is the online version for THE VISITATION Manual. https://digital.library.villanova.edu/files/vudl:788801/MASTER.

Visitation Sister: Thanks for finding it!

Anna: Thank you, Sherry??

Sherry: I totally agree, Sr. Susan. I am just so lousy with showing up to scheduled prayers in my own house. I think that spontaneous prayers make the relationship with God alive, dynamic – personal. Like me sending my husband and my daughter little messages through the day… to make them laugh. Or smile when I remind them how much I love them.

Should We Not Care for Our Health?

Question: Was it imprudent of St. Francis to suggest St. Jane to “not keep any sort of nurse”?

Denise: He did not mean literally (I think) to give up her nurse, rather to detach from her. Or indifference. I love the term holy indifference.

Sherry: As for the question. I do not understand what it means “to keep a nurse.” Can someone explain please? Thanks.

Visitation Sister: St. Francis was referring to himself. As the loving guide of St Jane’s soul.

Anna: Beautiful.

Rose: Her Spiritual Director. Oh, I see. What a beautiful relationship.

Anna: That must have been hard for St. Jane… no doubt grace needed to achieve detachment.

Sherry: I was just thinking of this today. My Spiritual Director – who had the soul and the gentle Spirit of St. Francis de Sales was taken from me within one day. I did not allow myself to grieve too much. But at this retreat I noticed how much I miss our Spiritual friendship and the things we talked about – only he could somehow understand. Simply because he read the same books as I did.

Is Self-Renunciation Self-Centered?

Question: Is self-renunciation contradictory? Is it born out of a self-interested desire to be totally empty and filled with God? Is it, in fact, a selfish/self-centered pursuit?

Sherry: That is such a good question.

Rose: Isn’t it what God wills for us to do? If we attain this then we are just following His Will.

Sherry: But in the end – it is not selfish. Because dying to oneself only can be done out of love for something outside of us. And love is always sacrificial. True self-renunciation is a gift of love. Given away – and not given to ourselves.

Anna: We are connected to the vine and to want to be on the vine is our natural home which is to say we love God and our neighbor as ourselves. So, I see it this way… self-centered often is disconnected to the vine and wanting worldly things.

Sherry: I agree. Self-comfort.

Rose: And this is not fully attainable without His Grace, Love, and Mercy.

Anna: I agree.

Sherry: The desire for self-renunciation truly is the fruit of Grace itself. I do not think that we can even produce this desire. But we can cooperate with it. When given.

Visitation Sister: God wants us to be filled with Himself, that is our purpose in existence.

Rose: So, this is His Will for us. So, we become united with Him.

Anna: We see the fruits of this in the lives of the saints.

Sherry: More of my Lord. More of You. I must decrease and you must increase!

Anna: We can ask God to “draw near” … ejaculatory prayer.

Denise: June is the month of Sacred Heart of Jesus. St Margaret Maria, pray for us!

Visitation Sister: Yes, and I will pray for you all at our Sacred heart Novena! God bless!

Anna: Please do, Sister.

Sherry: Have I shared the beautiful thought here about the connection of time and love? It led me to think about being ONE with God. I hope this speaks to you as it spoke to me.

Fr. Dumitru Staniloae makes a beautiful connection between the concepts of time and love. According to Fr. Dumitru, from God’s perspective, time is an interval between God’s offer of love to us and our response to this very love. He explains that love, as a gift of oneself to another, always awaits a response from the other. Time is that interval that awaits a return of divine love. Thus, within God Himself, there is no time (only eternity), as the interval of waiting is reduced to zero, each person of the Trinity loving the others immediately, perfectly, and completely.

However, for us humans living in time, God gives us the gift of time precisely in order for us to struggle and grow into His love. Viewed in this way, every moment of time is both a gift as well as an invitation. We are invited to taste eternity by receiving again and again this divine Love. Love, in this sense, is the only true reason for the time we are given here on earth.

If you enjoyed this article, why not join us at our Living Jesus Chat Room of the Visitation Sisters. We read a passage of St. Francis de Sales and then gather great insights and sharing!